H3T Anti-Sway Bar Linkage

[Portager]

I've broken 3 anti-sway bar linkages now. Almost every time I go off-road I break one, although on the last trip I broke it on the last real obstacle. I hear it pop, so I know it is always areas that push the articulation limits of the rear axle. However, I'm wondering why I have more trouble than other H3T's and what I can do about it.

I think a contributing factor is the weight of the SlantBack and the cargo slide. The other idea I thought of is the low profile shock mounts could be a contributing factor. With the stock shock mounts and shocks the shocks bottom out before the full travel of the axle. The low profile shock mount moves the shock mount up an inch, gaining ground clearance and allowing move articulation. I believe this may be contributing to my linkage problem.

The next question is what to do about it? I'm starting to get embarrassed asking Tustin Hummer to replace them under warranty. I guess I could disconnect the anti-sway bar linkage before I go off road, but I think I need to check the break lines and anti-lock brake cables to make sure they won't get overextended and break. Also, between airing down and installing my rock rings I’m pushing the time limit. I don’t want another thing to have to do while everyone is waiting on me.

Does anybody know of heavy duty anti-sway bar linkages or quick disconnect linkages for the H3/H3T?

Any other ideas or suggestions?

 

[alrock]

Are you still on OEM shocks or did you change those out? I believe the OEMs have limiters/bump stops built into them to help prevent over extension whereas aftermarket ones may not have that feature. (Not 100% sure on that). I'm not convinced the tomp shock mounts allow more articulation but if they do then perhaps they are not allowing the shocks to do their job of limiting travel and that job is now falling to the sway bar linkage. If that's the case then limiting straps may be the best answer.

 

[06 H3]

Limiting straps could help or JKS disconnects. Just because they are easy disconnects doesnt mean you have to disconnect them. My brother has a set on his JK and they are very stout. I need to find the model # but KS trekker uses them and possibly paladine.

 

[Hunner]

:corn::shifty:

Just some general observations not specific to anyone and can be considered only my opinion and discoveries, apply as needed.
Are you also running shackles? I believe these allow more down travel.
I do believe you need to address ABS and brake line length when changing travel.
I'm still trying to figure out how if you raise a lower shock mount that does not pre-compress the shock by that amount, thus reducing the upward travel. I was told on several occasions I was wrong about that?
Things I do know, as an example the OEM front shock does have a limiter bump in there.

The rear OEM does not.

The Bilstein replacement for a lifted 1500 truck is longer than OEM.

I'm still thinking about how raising the lower shock mount adds downward travel because I think the OEM shock is almost if not fully extended with the stock mount and adding shackles bangs it at the limit and disconnects do also. I guess you would get back that length you pre-compressed? I guess it can be run that way as some people are doing but at some point I believe the OEM shock will fail after repeated use to the limit.
Just like the front with torsions turned up the stock shocks are topping out and sway bar links at full droop have the ends maxed out aiming up to full droop, CAN be run that way but will eventually destroy the shocks as well as give a crappy ride.
I run some Curries on the front. They are fabricators model you can cut to length leaving some adjustment. So you might check those out.

My stock rear shocks were leaking at or less than 10,000 miles, made by Tennco.
:corn::shifty:

 

[Portager]

I am still running stock shocks, and I do think the low profile shock mounts are preventing the shocks from reaching their limit and allowing more travel than the anti-sway bar linkage can support.




Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk, which removes "unnecessary" returns.

 

[08SolarFlareH3]

There is someone with an H3T running JKS quick disconnect sway bar links because they had the same problem with breaking. I don't remember there user name or what forum.

 

[Hunner]

This is a tough one to figure out. I have no way to experiment. The results will be interesting. I hope you can find a solution.

Ok bear with me I did not quite understand Portager's last statement.

Quote
I do think the low profile shock mounts are preventing the shocks from reaching their limit and allowing more travel than the anti-sway bar linkage can support.
end quote.

Do you mean reaching their upward limit or downward. That is where I was lost, if you are saying down but don't reach the limit but do allow more travel?
How do you think longer links will solve this?
Or do you mean up and it is over extending the links or compressing them to the point of breaking.
Sorry for the confusion I really want to understand this.

 

[AZtraveler]

I'm running a 1" shackle lift and low profile shock mounts. After breaking a number of links - including non-OEM brands. So I installed quick disconnects. When needed I only remove one side - which allows articulation, but still holds the stabilizer bar in place. That's solved the problem for me.

 

[Portager]

Do you mean reaching their upward limit or downward. That is where I was lost, if you are saying down but don't reach the limit but do allow more travel?
How do you think longer links will solve this?
Or do you mean up and it is over extending the links or compressing them to the point of breaking.
Sorry for the confusion I really want to understand this.

I am talking about the downward travel and the linkage seams to breaking under tension. I do not have shackles. Since the low profile shock mount attachment point is ~1" higher than stock shock mount, the shocks are compressed further at normal height so the axle is ~1" lower when the shock reaches its full extension. However, if the stock rear shocks don't have a downward travel limit as you indicate then that shouldn't matter to the anti-sway bar linkages. Maybe the solution is to add a downward travel limiter? That should prevent linkage breakage, avoid over extending the shocks and avoid brake line and ABS cable issues.

I'm running a 1" shackle lift and low profile shock mounts. After breaking a number of links - including non-OEM brands. So I installed quick disconnects. When needed I only remove one side - which allows articulation, but still holds the stabilizer bar in place. That's solved the problem for me.

AZtraveler, did you extend your break lines and ABS cables? What make and model disconnects did you use?

 

[kflips]

I believe KS Trekker, Beitodestrafe & maybe Palading have quick disconnects -- I think JKS 3100 but you would need to PM them

I have RD swaybar extenders

I have an extended bracket to the rear diff that holds the brake line to provide extension. If you need a picture of that I can get one.

 

[08SolarFlareH3]

I have an extended bracket to the rear diff that holds the brake line to provide extension.

Was this done after the failure at RC?

 

[Hunner]

Ok I may not have this correct but if those mounts do raise or compress the shock say 1 inch, (it seems to grow in some reports) then when extended would you not just be getting back that 1 inch lost at normal height with stock shock mounting plates?
I may be having a senior moment or missing the affect it has.
Either way if you think you are over extending the shock but want the extra travel, would not longer shocks and extended sway links or AZ Travelers solution be the answer?
Limit straps would restrict the travel but would probably save the links.
You may have to get a custom length strap as I did for the front and allow a bit for stretch under extreme load even with triple layers. Some of the off the shelf straps are wimpy. I had mine made with the tabs reversed from each other so I could mount one on top of the shock and the other turned to fit the bottom shock mount. So there are options with the straps.
Top blue one is heavy duty lower black is what 4wheel parts and most places carry.

If it comes to that I have a source that can make heavy duty ones custom lengths and mounting tabs. I'm not sure in this case that is the answer to keep the extra travel.
I'm not sure of a top mounting point on the T either, maybe the sway bar link mount?
However this is an interesting situation.

 

[kflips]

Was this done after the failure at RC?

Yes - extended bracket after failure at RC

 

[Portager]

In reading the literature on the anti-swat bar quick disconnects, they say that they provide greater articulation to improve traction. I can see where keeping the tires on the ground would be important if you didn’t have a locking differential. However, since I have lockers I don’t see why I need extreme articulation.

 

[4speedfunk]

I'm in complete agreement...lockers and electronic traction control means you can go further on three-wheels than a typical Jeep. Having all four wheels on the ground is certainly better but, the H3 does not need mega-flex to get thru tight spots. It takes awhile to get used to wheeling with tires in the air, (relax the butt pucker)...but once you learn the technique, you'll realize how amazing it is that such a flat, stiff, suspension can tackle really harsh terrain with only 4"-6" of travel.

Instead of disconnecting the sway bar...just make some beefy links that won't break. Grab some 0.50" bar-stock and some heim joints...and have at it. I just completed a SOA, and I'll have to do something similar if I want to keep a rear sway bar. Its a good 6" over stock, and I'm sure stock links will not get the job done.

 

[Hunner]

Trycycling!

This is stock rear sway bar and stock links back in 06 we all thought that was awesome articulation! Still is.

 

[AZtraveler]

AZtraveler, did you extend your break lines and ABS cables? What make and model disconnects did you use?

After breaking a number of links I started running with the stabilizer bar completely removed when towing my truck to events. I did extend the break lines and ABS wiring - but Brodie did it without extending by just rerouting the lines. When I started overlanding and towing a trailer I added the disconnects. They were made by a company called Quicker Disconnects out of Colorado - but they are out of business now.

A couple of notes, the disconnects came with straps to fasten the stabilizer bar up to the shocks so it didn't flop around during disconnected travel. Those broke during heavy articulation, but I found that removing only one worked just as well - and kept the stabilizer bar under control. And - the company made disconnects for the front - but discontinued them after customers experienced problems with half shafts becoming disconnected.

 

[H3TBone]

I just took the rear sway bar off and I never missed it. Still drives great and the articulation is awesome. I didn't have to extend the brake or ABS lines.

 

[AZtraveler]

rear disconnects

I just took the rear sway bar off and I never missed it. Still drives great and the articulation is awesome. I didn't have to extend the brake or ABS lines.

About the only route for getting my rig to Utah, Colorado, etc. is expressway through the mountains. I felt things getting a little "squirrelly" at speeds above 60-65 mph without the stabilizer - so opted to use it until leaving the pavement. If I wasn't pulling a trailer - and/or not going above 60-65 mph it wouldn't have been necessary to put the stabilizer back on. Just a personal choice that worked for me.

 

[Portager]

Ok I may not have this correct but if those mounts do raise or compress the shock say 1 inch, (it seems to grow in some reports) then when extended would you not just be getting back that 1 inch lost at normal height with stock shock mounting plates?
I may be having a senior moment or missing the affect it has.
Either way if you think you are over extending the shock but want the extra travel, would not longer shocks and extended sway links or AZ Travelers solution be the answer?
Limit straps would restrict the travel but would probably save the links.
You may have to get a custom length strap as I did for the front and allow a bit for stretch under extreme load even with triple layers. Some of the off the shelf straps are wimpy. I had mine made with the tabs reversed from each other so I could mount one on top of the shock and the other turned to fit the bottom shock mount. So there are options with the straps.

If it comes to that I have a source that can make heavy duty ones custom lengths and mounting tabs. I'm not sure in this case that is the answer to keep the extra travel.
I'm not sure of a top mounting point on the T either, maybe the sway bar link mount?
However this is an interesting situation.

You have a good point! If the shock is compressed 1" more than normal, then at full extension, it would be extended 1" less than with stock shock mounts. I haven't seen any issues with the shocks so I don't think I'm over extending them.

However, I am definitely breaking anti-sway bar linkages and I’m getting tired of it.

I could replace the stock linkage with a custom, over designed, monster linkage. However, would I be moving the failure point to the next weakest link, like the anti-sway bar? I think the best approach is the extension limiting straps Hunner showed. I just need to determine how to attach them and how long to make them. I think I'll ask Tustin Hummer for suggestions when I take it in to replace the linkage #3. At least now I don’t think the problem is the low profile shock mounts, so I don’t mind asking them to fix it under the wrranty.

 

[Hunner]

I got my straps from OK Offroad. It's in Oklahoma. A friend that works on Rovers does business with them and the owner is a Rover guy. He even put our Midwest Hummer group that ran Kansas Rocks on his web page for awhile in a slide show.
Sent me stickers that said "Rover Recovery Vehicle" to tease my friend at the shop that works on them.
He makes them onsite and can place the tabs either way you want them. They are usually bent slightly to clear away from mounting bolts. I chose to use the top of the shock under the upper mounting point and reversed one at the bottom of the shock. From that image of a T in the rear it looks like you could use the upper link bolt and lower shock but you will have to detemine that. I made mine just a little shorter than I needed in case when the weight of the suspension came down on them it could allow for any stretch. How ever the triple layer affect of folding them over and stitching did not allow much. I did all that when I first discovered the extra travel in the front if I dropped a nut on top of the shock before mounting to extend it 1/2 inch.
You can see here how I guess at the length including a bit of tension and the resulting stretch. That let the upper a-arm softly occasionally "touch" the metal bump stop on the frame.
So you would need to figure the length at full droop and make it just a little shorter, in my opinion. Maybe 1/2 inch?
Hope that helps jump start your ideas. You know I love "show and tell":shifty:

This shows my "poor man's" shock extension of adding a loose 1/2 nut that is 1/2 inch tall and mounting point. I also had to use longer links in the front to achieve that.