Quest for the Holy Grail... (Differentails, Moab, and Stuff)

[Schwarttzy]

First, I have never heard or seen photos of the Iron Differential breaking. Now I bet some stories are out there, but I'm looking for physical evidence like a photo. Because I think that these Iron Differentials aren't breaking that often and I'm planning on buying a complete Iron Differential that I found in a junkyard for $750. The vehicle has the VIN #56TEN13L488132431, I know it's a V8, but I got my fingers crossed that it is an Adventure Alpha. Can someone point me in the right direction on how to look up the VIN?

Also, I'm preparing to go to Moab Utah in June. I don't want to break down and have to wait days for parts to show up. Which is why I want a few basic spares with me. Currently I think that I need a spare front drive shaft, two (though it was 18mm) 16mm tie-rods, and to buy + install the Outfitter Design LLC Steering Upgrade.

Do you guys have any other spare parts you bring?

Should I go with a junkyard special axle shaft or the RCV upgrade?

Currently I'm going to buy the MOOG tie-rods from RockAuto, unless you think someone else sells stronger tie-rods?

Do I need both the Inner and the Outer Tie-Rods? I think it's only the inner that go bad... anyone break the outer tie-rod?

 

[3Hummers]

Front tie rods( inner and outer ) and a half shaft and you should be good. Tie rods are 16mm unless you found some custom ones. Steering shaft repair from one of the three available would be a big plus. BlackSheep Week is in April if you can make that there will be plenty of skilled mechanical assistance and spare parts.

 

[Schwarttzy]

Front tie rods( inner and outer ) and a half shaft and you should be good. Tie rods are 16mm unless you found some custom ones. Steering shaft repair from one of the three available would be a big plus. BlackSheep Week is in April if you can make that there will be plenty of skilled mechanical assistance and spare parts.

Could have sworn that the tie-rods went from 16mm to 18mm in 2008 and up H3's. I've been to Moab before, still got Moab 4x4 Outpost saved on my cell phone, and I'll have no trouble installing the parts.

I would love to come out in April, but I don't think that is going to happen.

 

[3Hummers]

Tie rods went from 14mm to 16mm.

 

[digglesworth]

eric.... if you do the outfitter design steering rack kit, document the process. that's the next thing on my list to do.

I have an 06 so ive got the 14mm tie rods. I have a set of 16s I got from a member that im gonna put in when I do the rack mount. are the 14s worth keeping as trail spares?

the empi shafts are like $66 on autoanything.com I think... those have been a good trail spare/replacement for some

can moab be fun for a non-adv H3 or is it too technical?

 

[atvspeed4]

Its not the housing thats breaking with the iron diff its the ring and pinion.

 

[06 H3]

I would say bring what you have to avoid being raped at fully priced parts in moab.

The essentials are tie rods, half shafts and have some fun! If you break a steering rack (highly doubt it with the new brackets on the market) you can drive with a broken one and to avoid killing the PS pump read this...

http://www.hummer4x4offroad.com/forum/showthread.php?5364-Oil-loss-from-a-broken-steering-rack

 

[06 H3]

Its not the housing thats breaking with the iron diff its the ring and pinion.

yep...happened to me twice, not in moab though. if you just stay off the throttle and wheel smart you should be good.

can moab be fun for a non-adv H3 or is it too technical?

Many go without the adv pack and still have fun. They have everything from dirt roads to bring your tow rig cause you will destroy your buggy. Its fun for all different types of rigs.

I know many fear breaking in moab but be smart. I think Jakesz28 is the perfect example of that, he went with the adv package and wheeled some tough stuff without breaking.

 

[Schwarttzy]

Tie rods went from 14mm to 16mm.

AHHHHH okay, I knew it jump 2mm just messed up the size.

 

[Schwarttzy]

Its not the housing thats breaking with the iron diff its the ring and pinion.

O well I'm not worried at all then. Cool! I'm going to buy that housing and get the ring and pinion cyro treated. It's not like the ring and pinion is much smaller than a Dana 44 right?

to avoid killing the PS pump read this.. Oil-loss-from-a-broken-steering-rack

That is really clever.

 

[atvspeed4]

The ring and pinion is much smaller than a Dana 44 but more importantly the housing of our diffs flexes more than a Dana 44 which is really bad. Some have discussed solid pinion spacers as an improvement.

 

[06 H3]

yep, ditching the crush sleeve and using a bolt to put some load on the bearing caps to prevent deflection. That should help me some seeing both times it was a broken pinion. Once I do the 2 things mentioned above I will either start breaking halfshafts just how GM intended the "fuse theory" to work or stop breaking all together and see some improvements.

 

[Schwarttzy]

yep, ditching the crush sleeve and using a bolt to put some load on the bearing caps to prevent deflection.

That is some really cool info that I'll have to do to my junkyard axle. Where did/do you get said bolt?

 

[Schwarttzy]

eric.... if you do the outfitter design steering rack kit, document the process. that's the next thing on my list to do.

I have an 06 so ive got the 14mm tie rods. I have a set of 16s I got from a member that im gonna put in when I do the rack mount. are the 14s worth keeping as trail spares?

the empi shafts are like $66 on autoanything.com I think... those have been a good trail spare/replacement for some

can moab be fun for a non-adv H3 or is it too technical?

You don't need and Adventure Package, Tip-Toe Between the Rocks can be done by a stock explorer and it's a lot of fun.

I plan on documenting the process for the outfitter design in my build page.

I'm not going to replace the 14mm ones until they break, then I'm going to stick 16mm ones on it.

 

[4speedfunk]

I'm planning on buying a complete Iron Differential that I found in a junkyard for $750. The vehicle has the VIN #56TEN13L488132431, I know it's a V8, but I got my fingers crossed that it is an Adventure Alpha

An Alpha axle is hardly the holy grail....its 4.11 geared. You'de be better off to get a non-Alpha axle with the 4.56 gearing (yours is a 5-cyl. right?)....save the hassle of a gear swap. The REAL holy grail is the non-alpha AP front axle from an 09-10 model. That axle gets you all the goodies....cast-iron case, e-locker, and 4.56 gearing. Not to mention it would probably be lower mileage.

Other stuff...
1. You don't necessarily need a spare front driveshaft...you can pull a bad one, switch to 4HI-Lock and get home okay without it.
2. Or..see if you can get the front driveshaft from that same junkyard H3...package deal!
3. I have a good stub shaft (commonly breaks) and tube for the drivers-side...$100 shipped.
4. Skip the RCVs and spend the money on the Outfitter Design Diff Bushing kit.




PS...When is your next trip to climbing trip to Slade?

 

[06 H3]

3. I have a good stub shaft (commonly breaks) and tube for the drivers-side...$100 shipped.

Dammit...I told myself I would stop spending money on the AAM-7 but I may jump on that if no one else does. I need to use my money to get rid of the AAM-7!

 

[Schwarttzy]

I didn't mean the the iron differential axle is the holy grail. I had some text that I ended up deleting, talking about how we're all looking for some differential that we can swap in there for extra beef and how I'm just giving up and going to try and live with the Iron Differential.

I know the gear ratio is wrong, but I want to swap out the crush sleeve and a few other things possibly which means I'll need to rebuild it. If I could find an Adventure with the 4.56 in it, I'm definitely choosing that one, but so far I haven't.

In the past I would just hit up junkyards for spare axle shafts, and I think that's the best option again.

I probably won't head down to Slade until April and I would love to run some trails down there with you.

 

[Steve #1]

First, I have never heard or seen photos of the Iron Differential breaking. Now I bet some stories are out there, but I'm looking for physical evidence like a photo.

I've seen two CI diffs break on the same obstacle within minuets of each other. One was just the gears and one ended up with a hole in the housing. Sorry, but don't have pictures.

can moab be fun for a non-adv H3 or is it too technical?

It seems lately that a bunch of folks have decided that the H3 is useless if it doesn't have the adventure package which just isn't true. I've made it past the obstacle I mentioned above many times without the adventure package and without breaking. The AP may make some things a little easier, but not having it by no means leaves you sitting on the bench. What I witnessed in Moab (and other places) in regard to stock AP vs stock non-AP, driver skill, or confidence, is the bigger factor.

 

[Schwarttzy]

Were they using the skinny peddle?

 

[alrock]

Skinny pedal is a factor, but more important is picking the right line. W/O a rear locker or the 4:1 case, a driver must choose the line more carefully to maximize the capabilities of the H3. The Adventure allows a more casual approach to picking the lines. I had about six trips to Moab before I got the 4:1, and maybe another two after that before I got the rear locker. The only things I've broken on the trail: transfer case, due to a rock impact; transmission, due to a pump failure.

 

[Schwarttzy]

Most people tend to think that I'm bat **** crazy when I go off-road, but I have never had mechanical issues with my H3 while off-road.

 

[cgalpha08]

I am completely unlocked and I don't have the 4:1 t case. The way I see it is that wheeling like that will make me a better driver in the future. Sure there are some obstacles that I may not make it over but for the most part I've been able to make it where I've wanted to go

Plus its more fun, more of a challenge

Sent from my DROID BIONIC

 

[3Hummers]

I have seen base H3s do amazing things with the right driver behind the wheel.

 

[digglesworth]

I fully intend to go out and give it hell in the spring...

 

[Steve #1]

Were they using the skinny peddle?

Not an unreasonable amount. I probably used more as the obstacle has two steps that the front and rear have to climb at the same time. I know I have to bump it a little to get up and they were taking it a little more gently but ultimately had to work harder. I will say both were H3Ts and the wheelbase does make it a bit harder for them.

Here it is from a different trip. BTW the people off to the side were driving built Jeeps and buggies and were going to help us up because there was no way we would make it. :giggle:

[video=youtube_share;IR4RO2X6D-0]http://youtu.be/IR4RO2X6D-0[/video]